In universalizing imperialism, you’re erasing it’s actual character.
Capitalism by its very nature is a system of accumulation. The fact that Russia is not imperialized by the west means the west is working to open Russia’s markets by force. This isn’t unique to Russia, it’s just that Russia is the topic here.
Trump is not a Russia ally. The two countries stand opposed on the emerging multipolar world. What Trump is forced to recognize is industrial and millitary power, which Russia is still rising in while the imperialist countries de-industrialize.
The capitalist class is the enemy. However, what you are doing is erasing imperialism as a stage in capitalism, vulgarly reducing it to being synonymous with capitalism and therefore either universally applicable, ie Burkina Faso would be imperialist, or a simple policy preference by some states, essentially Kautsky’s error. Neither are accurate. In eliminating national distinctions between the capitalist class, you eliminate proletarian internationalism.
Imperialism is a stage of capitalism, an essential stage in which all capitalists would engage if only given the opportunity: whether they be from America, Russia, Mexico, or even Burkina Faso. Ownership of the means of production (or owing shares in the corporations that own the means of production) is available to capitalists of every nationality.
If Trump isn’t an ally of Russia’s capitalists then why did he declare that Russia posed no cybersecurity threat to the US and then dissolve the wing of the pentagon that worked to counter such a threat.
The idea that denying the fact that the capitalists have no personal belief in nationalism somehow magically negates international solidarity is nonsensical: the truth is that nationalism is just codified xenophobia, and is a tool used by the capitalists (and relentlessly promoted through their mass media empires) in order to divide the workers, this preventing cooperation across national and ethnic ‘borders’.
Edit to add: Russia’s markets were opened to capitalists 35 years ago (which was the point of my original post on this thread), the idea that Russia is somehow separate from the global imperialist program is pure disinformation.
Nobody is arguing that Russia would not engage in imperialism if given the opportunity. The point being driven home is that they do not have that opportunity, and as such are targeted by imperialists. This puts them on opposing sides. Again, it’s purely self-interest, not ideology.
As for Trump, this is just BlueAnon conspiracy theory. Trump is self-interested. If Trump was a Russian ally, Trump would have erased sanctions and forced an end to the Russo-Ukrainian war, would have dissolved NATO already, and more.
As for capitalists not having a “belief” in nationalism, that’s not at all what I mean. The national bourgeoisie are those that are largely constrained within the domestic markets, not international financiers. Think the people that own factories, vs. the ones owning Blackrock. The national bourgeoisie of countries under threat of imperialism have aligned interests with the proletariat and peasantry in opposing imperialism. They are still obstacles to socialism, but are progressive against imperialism.
Nationalism in the imperial core protects imperialism, but national liberation in the global south opposes imperialism. Palestinian nationalism is progressive, as is the nationalism of Burkina Faso, as was Vietnamese and Cuban nationalism. The National liberation movement is a progressive one against imperialism and therefore assists the transition to socialism.
As for Trump, this is just BlueAnon conspiracy theory. Trump is self-interested. If Trump was a Russian ally, Trump would have erased sanctions and forced an end to the Russo-Ukrainian war, would have dissolved NATO already, and more.
But he has tried his hardest to do all of tgose things. The only reason he hasn’t succeeded (yet) is because he isn’t a dictator and so doesn’t have absolute power (again, yet).
The national bourgeoisie are those that are largely constrained within the domestic markets, not international financiers.
The petty bourgeoisie are themselves part of the working class, much as they may deny it.
Nationalism in the imperial core protects imperialism, but national liberation in the global south opposes imperialism. Palestinian nationalism is progressive, as is the nationalism of Burkina Faso, as was Vietnamese and Cuban nationalism. The National liberation movement is a progressive one against imperialism and therefore assists the transition to socialism.
I don’t agree with this at all, ‘nationalist solidarity’ is a trap designed to pervert true class solidarity. The revolution is either international or it is doomed to fail.
I think we basically have to agree to disagree, though I do commend you for taking the time to have an actual discussion, rather than just accusing me of being a liberal and resorting to cheap insults :)
Trump has not tried his hardest to erase sanctions, end the war in Ukraine, etc. If he wanted, he could do so right now. Trump has no reason to be a Russian ally.
As for the petite bourgeoisie, they aren’t necessarily working class, though they do labor. The national bourgeoisie aren’t the same as the petite bourgeoisie.
As for nationalism in the global south, this is also internationalist. I recommend looking into Marxist analysis of the nation and nationalism, again, Cuban, Palestinian, Vietnamese, Chinese, etc. nationalism is all progressive against imperialism in their wars for liberation. Once liberated, then the process of building socialism can genuinely begin (as it has in the socialist countries mentioned).
Trump definitely has worked towards removing sanctions from Russia, and has several times promoted Russian ‘peace deals’ which would gift them chunks of Ukraine (an imperialist aim of Russia’s). He can’t do literally anything he wants, which is why this hasn’t happened. His reasons for being a Russian ally go back decades to his longstanding business interests, which have been entwined with Russia for decades.
Also, my experience of nationalism in the global south suggests otherwise. Take Latin America, for example: nationalist movements may have been instrumental in developing support for independence from Spain, but actual independence from Spain was won by transnational movements not limited to any one state or ethnic identify. Moreover, the modern day nationalists in each state are basically racist movements which do nothing but undermine working class solidarity (Chilean nationalists, for example, are known to carry out acts of violence against anyone whose skin is dark enough that they might conceivably be Peruvian or Bolivian, despite the fact that this includes many Chileans with indigenous ancestry).
Trump is not a Russian ally, he is interested in harvesting Ukraine for minerals. The Russo-Ukrainain war is not one of imperialism on Russia’s part, annexation is not imperialism. This is just BlueAnon, sorry to say, it’s blaming the Russians on Statesian failures.
As for nationalism in the global south, it is not opposed to internationalism. It is nationalism in the global north that is opposed to internationalism. I highly recommend reading Fanon, who wrote extensively on the psychological aspects of colonialism and the class outlook of national liberation.
Trump has been an explicit supporter of Russian business interests for a lot longer than he has been involved in politics: this is not a conspiracy theory, or is a statement of fact.
Be wary of making such generalisations about nationalism, even in the global south. Like I said, I have personal experience of Latin American nationalists partaking in racially motivated violence against indigenous people, and so therefore very much opposed to internationalism.
Trump being a Russian ally is a conspiracy theory, and is used to justify pushing problems from the US onto Russia. Trump’s problems and interests are of American origin.
As for Nationalism in the global south, it’s necessarily an oversimplification. Trade unions can also be violently racist, it’s wrong but not indicative of trade unions being wrong. And for indigenous peoples, they are the ones whose nationalism would be progressive, not the nationalism of those not indigenous.
In universalizing imperialism, you’re erasing it’s actual character.
Capitalism by its very nature is a system of accumulation. The fact that Russia is not imperialized by the west means the west is working to open Russia’s markets by force. This isn’t unique to Russia, it’s just that Russia is the topic here.
Trump is not a Russia ally. The two countries stand opposed on the emerging multipolar world. What Trump is forced to recognize is industrial and millitary power, which Russia is still rising in while the imperialist countries de-industrialize.
The capitalist class is the enemy. However, what you are doing is erasing imperialism as a stage in capitalism, vulgarly reducing it to being synonymous with capitalism and therefore either universally applicable, ie Burkina Faso would be imperialist, or a simple policy preference by some states, essentially Kautsky’s error. Neither are accurate. In eliminating national distinctions between the capitalist class, you eliminate proletarian internationalism.
Imperialism is a stage of capitalism, an essential stage in which all capitalists would engage if only given the opportunity: whether they be from America, Russia, Mexico, or even Burkina Faso. Ownership of the means of production (or owing shares in the corporations that own the means of production) is available to capitalists of every nationality.
If Trump isn’t an ally of Russia’s capitalists then why did he declare that Russia posed no cybersecurity threat to the US and then dissolve the wing of the pentagon that worked to counter such a threat.
The idea that denying the fact that the capitalists have no personal belief in nationalism somehow magically negates international solidarity is nonsensical: the truth is that nationalism is just codified xenophobia, and is a tool used by the capitalists (and relentlessly promoted through their mass media empires) in order to divide the workers, this preventing cooperation across national and ethnic ‘borders’.
Edit to add: Russia’s markets were opened to capitalists 35 years ago (which was the point of my original post on this thread), the idea that Russia is somehow separate from the global imperialist program is pure disinformation.
Nobody is arguing that Russia would not engage in imperialism if given the opportunity. The point being driven home is that they do not have that opportunity, and as such are targeted by imperialists. This puts them on opposing sides. Again, it’s purely self-interest, not ideology.
As for Trump, this is just BlueAnon conspiracy theory. Trump is self-interested. If Trump was a Russian ally, Trump would have erased sanctions and forced an end to the Russo-Ukrainian war, would have dissolved NATO already, and more.
As for capitalists not having a “belief” in nationalism, that’s not at all what I mean. The national bourgeoisie are those that are largely constrained within the domestic markets, not international financiers. Think the people that own factories, vs. the ones owning Blackrock. The national bourgeoisie of countries under threat of imperialism have aligned interests with the proletariat and peasantry in opposing imperialism. They are still obstacles to socialism, but are progressive against imperialism.
Nationalism in the imperial core protects imperialism, but national liberation in the global south opposes imperialism. Palestinian nationalism is progressive, as is the nationalism of Burkina Faso, as was Vietnamese and Cuban nationalism. The National liberation movement is a progressive one against imperialism and therefore assists the transition to socialism.
But he has tried his hardest to do all of tgose things. The only reason he hasn’t succeeded (yet) is because he isn’t a dictator and so doesn’t have absolute power (again, yet).
The petty bourgeoisie are themselves part of the working class, much as they may deny it.
I don’t agree with this at all, ‘nationalist solidarity’ is a trap designed to pervert true class solidarity. The revolution is either international or it is doomed to fail.
I think we basically have to agree to disagree, though I do commend you for taking the time to have an actual discussion, rather than just accusing me of being a liberal and resorting to cheap insults :)
Trump has not tried his hardest to erase sanctions, end the war in Ukraine, etc. If he wanted, he could do so right now. Trump has no reason to be a Russian ally.
As for the petite bourgeoisie, they aren’t necessarily working class, though they do labor. The national bourgeoisie aren’t the same as the petite bourgeoisie.
As for nationalism in the global south, this is also internationalist. I recommend looking into Marxist analysis of the nation and nationalism, again, Cuban, Palestinian, Vietnamese, Chinese, etc. nationalism is all progressive against imperialism in their wars for liberation. Once liberated, then the process of building socialism can genuinely begin (as it has in the socialist countries mentioned).
Trump definitely has worked towards removing sanctions from Russia, and has several times promoted Russian ‘peace deals’ which would gift them chunks of Ukraine (an imperialist aim of Russia’s). He can’t do literally anything he wants, which is why this hasn’t happened. His reasons for being a Russian ally go back decades to his longstanding business interests, which have been entwined with Russia for decades.
Also, my experience of nationalism in the global south suggests otherwise. Take Latin America, for example: nationalist movements may have been instrumental in developing support for independence from Spain, but actual independence from Spain was won by transnational movements not limited to any one state or ethnic identify. Moreover, the modern day nationalists in each state are basically racist movements which do nothing but undermine working class solidarity (Chilean nationalists, for example, are known to carry out acts of violence against anyone whose skin is dark enough that they might conceivably be Peruvian or Bolivian, despite the fact that this includes many Chileans with indigenous ancestry).
Trump is not a Russian ally, he is interested in harvesting Ukraine for minerals. The Russo-Ukrainain war is not one of imperialism on Russia’s part, annexation is not imperialism. This is just BlueAnon, sorry to say, it’s blaming the Russians on Statesian failures.
As for nationalism in the global south, it is not opposed to internationalism. It is nationalism in the global north that is opposed to internationalism. I highly recommend reading Fanon, who wrote extensively on the psychological aspects of colonialism and the class outlook of national liberation.
Trump has been an explicit supporter of Russian business interests for a lot longer than he has been involved in politics: this is not a conspiracy theory, or is a statement of fact.
Be wary of making such generalisations about nationalism, even in the global south. Like I said, I have personal experience of Latin American nationalists partaking in racially motivated violence against indigenous people, and so therefore very much opposed to internationalism.
Trump being a Russian ally is a conspiracy theory, and is used to justify pushing problems from the US onto Russia. Trump’s problems and interests are of American origin.
As for Nationalism in the global south, it’s necessarily an oversimplification. Trade unions can also be violently racist, it’s wrong but not indicative of trade unions being wrong. And for indigenous peoples, they are the ones whose nationalism would be progressive, not the nationalism of those not indigenous.